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Thread: Gedmatch oracle question?

  1. #31
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    Alright I think I've come up with what're good estimates for both of you and will go into 'em below:


    Eurogenes K=36:




    The impression I get off these results is that you're about 45-50% Somali (green), ~20% South Asian (red), 10-20% West Asian (likely Arabian & Iranian ancestry & this is colored blue) & 5-10% Southeast African Bantu (purple). And that he is very very similar to you but less Somali and more West Asian at something ~40% Somali, ~20% South Asian, 20-30% West Asian & 5-10% Southeast African Bantu.

    I'm raising the bar for both your West Asian levels because you showed a lot of noise level percentages in various West Eurasian components that could be tied with being part West Asian (like 1% Iberian for you or 1% Balkan for him) & I've plunged those components into "other" as you seriously can't be sure of them.

     
    North African & Omotic are colored grey because they sit in a middle ground range. On the one hand you're most likely showing "Omotic" because there's some African Hunter-Gatherer ("Khoisan-Pygmy" etc.) related ancestry present in the Omotic component & you both probably have some of such ancestry (you even show below 1% levels of "Pygmy" for example) either from your Southeast African Bantu ancestry or even from Hunter-Gatherers found in Southern Somalia (former is more likely to me) but because I couldn't be sure about it or even "North African" which could be both a signal of Somali ancestry and some Near Eastern ancestries; I just colored them grey as they're really in a grey and unsure area.


    Both of your full K=36 results are already available in this thread so you're welcome to look at the components I lumped into "other".


    ANE K=7:


    Your shared results



    This run is quite relevant to me as it somewhat corroborates your "Somali" levels if one takes the Northeast African, East African & Central African components & adds them up for you guys. How so? Well, lets look at you... You come off as basically ~50% Somali via looking into K=36's percentages that way and then you're about ~38% "African" in K=7 and probably even a bit more than that as it can deflate peoples "African" levels a bit (so lets go with ~40%). Suppose you're 5-10% Southeast African Bantu. That chafes off 5-10% right there so what do you have left? 30-35% "African" ancestry... The average Somali is basically ~60% "African" (from run to run we'll vary between 55 to 65 basically). So if you're Southeast African Bantu ancestry is accounted for and set aside; you're roughly half as "African" as the average Somali (give or take). This really corroborates you being a ~50 percenter (again; give or take)

    It's a roughly similar case with "Barwani" (IIRC) as I've taken to labeling him...

    Beyond that both of you showing "ANE" & "ASE" (basically ASI) corroborates your South Asian ancestry (and some of that "ANE" could very well be owed to being part Iranian or something) & your high "ENF" fits with having South Asian & West Asian ancestry that would put you a bit above the Somali ~42% ENF mark in this run, granted, there are ~44% ENF Somalis in K=7.

    --

    If anyone would like to chime in with extra remarks or correct me anywhere-> please do (was in a bit of a hurry). Anyway, mate, I have a midterm tomorrow and will be a bit pre-occupied throughout some of the days after so I thought I'd try and leave you with this for now.

    I'll add one more tidbit of info for people other than you or me that're interested in this; "Barwani/Barawani" is basically paternally Bravanese / Barawi or "Barwani" (another coast town / city residing group on the Somali coast thought to be some Somali-Arabian-Iranian-Bantu crossing of some sort) & maternally Reer Xamar like Deftextra / Radwan.
    Last edited by Awale; 10-13-2015 at 08:24 PM.
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  3. #32
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    Here is Deftextra's results for the puntDNAL K15:

    Admix Results (sorted):

    # Population Percent
    1 Horn_Of_Africa 22.98
    2 Wht_Nile_River 13.80
    3 Caucasian 13.37
    4 S_Indian 11.60
    5 W_African 10.62
    6 SW_Asian 8.57
    7 Mediterranean 6.41
    8 Omo_River 5.10
    9 NE_European 2.68
    10 E_Asian 1.89
    11 S_African 1.22
    12 Amerindian 1.17

    Here is another Benadiri with similar results:

    S_Indian 13.13%
    Mediterranean 7.41%
    Siberian 0.60%
    Wht_Nile_River 13.53%
    Amerindian -
    S_African 1.46%
    E_Asian 1.58%
    Caucasian 16.38%
    NE_European 2.38%
    Omo_River 2.11%
    W_African 11.92%
    Horn_Of_Africa 18.68%
    Oceanian 0.53%
    Beringian -
    SW_Asian 10.28%


    They are 21% HOA, 15% Nilotic, 4% Omotic (which equals your 40% Somali), 13% S Indian, 15% Caucasian (28% West Asian), 10% European (mostly med), 10% SW Asian, and 12% West African.

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  5. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by puntDNALKing View Post
    They are 21% HOA, 15% Nilotic, 4% Omotic (which equals your 40% Somali)
    Ah, but you'll recall that Somalis also show "Southwest Asian" in your run:

     
    The Sheikh:

    # Population Percent
    1 Horn_Of_Africa 51.32
    2 Wht_Nile_River 27.69
    3 SW_Asian 6.47
    4 W_African 4.42
    5 Omo_River 3.86
    6 Mediterranean 3.67
    7 NE_European 1.56


    So there's likely some more Somali ancestry amok in your other components (some of that "Caucasian" is also likely owed to South Asian ancestry given that South Asians tend to show a lot of that in your run) but good to see similar estimates.
    Last edited by Awale; 10-14-2015 at 05:46 AM.
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  7. #34
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    Accidentally double posted.
    Last edited by Deftextra; 10-14-2015 at 09:30 PM.

  8. #35
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    Interesting. I loosely was kind of expecting this from many results I have seen of Somali's.
    The new MDLP ultimate calculator was quite interesting. Somali is high in mixed sharing and distance is not that far. This is the only calculator I have seen were Somali is included in my mixture with not that far distance.
    You think my last components could be owed from a south-east-Asian-ancestor? When I first saw my result, this was the only explanation I could think of, but then I realized that many South Asians also show small percentage of these components. But given the ASI component, can this calculator recognize this distinction?

    Admix Results (sorted):

    # Population Percent
    1 Subsaharian 33.14
    2 NearEast 18.71
    3 ANE 15.43
    4 ENF 10.49
    5 Caucas-Gedrosia 8.13
    6 ASI 7.08
    7 Paleo-African 2.62
    8 EastAsian 2.52
    9 Oceanian 1.89

    Single Population Sharing:

    # Population (source) Distance
    1 Afar 20.35
    2 Tygray 20.48
    3 Amhara 21.02
    4 Ethiopian 21.12
    5 Ethiopian_Jew 21.99
    6 Wolyata 22.61
    7 Esomali 23.98
    8 Coloured-D6 24.19
    9 Oromo 24.22
    10 Yemenese 24.43
    11 Somali 24.84
    12 Afar_WGA 26.37
    13 Morocco_S 27.45
    14 Coloured-EC 28.11
    15 Libyan 31.08
    16 Egyptan 31.5
    17 Ari 31.71
    18 Algerian 31.78
    19 Datog 31.93
    20 Yemen 32.07

    Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

    # Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
    1 64.5% Somali + 35.5% Mumbai_Jew @ 3.67
    2 56.4% Datog + 43.6% Roma_Macedonian @ 3.73
    3 66.7% Wolyata + 33.3% Mumbai_Jew @ 3.83
    4 65.4% Esomali + 34.6% Mumbai_Jew @ 4.02
    5 69.5% Somali + 30.5% Kashmiri @ 4.54
    6 70.3% Esomali + 29.7% Kashmiri @ 4.57
    7 66.9% Somali + 33.1% Pashtun-Afghan @ 4.63
    8 71.6% Wolyata + 28.4% Kashmiri @ 4.64
    9 72.2% Wolyata + 27.8% Pakistani @ 4.66
    10 71% Esomali + 29% Pakistani @ 4.75
    11 70.2% Somali + 29.8% Pakistani @ 4.82
    12 67.8% Esomali + 32.2% Pashtun-Afghan @ 4.84
    13 56.3% Datog + 43.7% Roma @ 4.9
    14 69.1% Wolyata + 30.9% Pashtun-Afghan @ 4.99
    15 56.2% Datog + 43.8% Roma_Bulgarian @ 5.01
    16 57.7% Datog + 42.3% Parsi @ 5.25
    17 70.4% Esomali + 29.6% Brahmins_from_Uttar_Pradesh @ 5.35
    18 70.2% Wolyata + 29.8% Cochin_Jew @ 5.37
    19 51.1% Masai_Kinyawa_MKK + 48.9% Roma_Macedonian @ 5.41
    20 66.7% Somali + 33.3% Tajik_Ishkashim @ 5.42

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  10. #36
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    Don't somebody Iranians come out as half "West Asian" or "Middle Eastern" and half "South Asian"? I wonder also if their recent Eurasian ancestry is ultimately from Balochistan, who are Iranian speakers but more South Asian? Also, the Bravese might be Swahili-ized after all if that one guy is representive.

  11. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by gihanga.rwanda View Post
    Don't somebody Iranians come out as half "West Asian" or "Middle Eastern" and half "South Asian"? I wonder also if their recent Eurasian ancestry is ultimately from Balochistan, who are Iranian speakers but more South Asian? Also, the Bravese might be Swahili-ized after all if that one guy is representive.
    His South Asian-related ancestry is too overt (~10% ASI despite only being like ~20% South Asian?!) to be owed to Iranians... But yes, I've wondered about the possibility of Baloch ancestors who might've been taken for Omani or Arabian traders of some sort. Will look into this further soon. As for the Bravanese; I got emailed by a Bravanese girl who saw my recent blog post on Reer Xamars, seems interested in getting tested. Lets hope her results are interesting.
    Last edited by Awale; 12-17-2015 at 11:07 AM.
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  13. #38
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    Someone help me interpret my results.
    This is what I got from ancestryDNA

    AFRICA 37%
    Africa Southeastern Bantu 27%
    Africa North 5%
    Trace regions 5%

    ASIA 25%
    Asia South 23%
    Trace Regions 2%
    Asia East 2%

    PACIFIC ISLANDER 3%
    Trace Regions 3%

    WEST ASIA 35%
    Middle East 35%

    I am reer xamar too.
    Last edited by Benadiri; 01-16-2016 at 11:24 AM.

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  15. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Benadiri View Post
    Someone help me interpret my results.
    This is what I got from ancestryDNA

    AFRICA 37%
    Africa Southeastern Bantu 27%
    Africa North 5%
    Trace regions 5%

    ASIA 25%
    Asia South 23%
    Trace Regions 2%
    Asia East 2%

    PACIFIC ISLANDER 3%
    Trace Regions 3%

    WEST ASIA 35%
    Middle East 35%

    I am reer xamar too.
    I have your raw data, my friend. Your brother (or you?) sent it to me via email. I'm looking into it all now and will get back to you and this thread soon. So far, I'd say you're actually extremely similar to Deftextra.
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  17. #40
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    Here are your general results:

     
    You are quite notably related to both the paternally Bravanese and maternally Shanshiyo dude as well as Deftextra who's Shanshiyo:





    I'm not awfully surprised by this... I expect most Benadiris/Reer Xamars and the like to be interrelated given the relatively small size of your community and the fact that you've all, by even your brother's claims, been intermarrying mostly with each other for centuries. I honestly would've been more intrigued if you weren't related to the two of them at all.

    Now for your ADMIXTURE results... You're extremely similar to both Deftextra and the Bravanese broski (more so to Deft) despite being of a different tribe (Hatimi) which claims Arabian descent (Deft's tribe is supposed to be of originally Central Asian / Eastern Iranian descent). Your brother told me a cousin of yours or something turned up with the Y-DNA J1? Was he tested by FTDNA? If so... Link me to where his kit is; seeing his exact subclade will be important but J1 already implies the possibility of originally Arabian paternal descent whilst Deft has a cousin who's R1a though he was tested via 23andme (IIRC) so no subclade & we can't exactly confirm originally paternal Central Asian or even generally Iranian descent but it is possible.

    Nevertheless, haplogroups aside, in terms of your actual general ancestry (when looking at your autosomal DNA), you like Deft, are of pretty mixed & diverse origins:


    You're roughly 35-40% "African" and 60-65% "Eurasian" (give or take). However I must note to you, as your brother seemed very confused and unaware of this, that Somalis themselves are basically a hybridization between "African" and mostly pre-historic West Eurasian ancestry (~40% West Eurasian & ~60% African) so do not translate that 35-40% as purely Somali ancestry as some of your West Eurasian / "Middle Eastern" ancestry is also clearly derived from being part Somali/Horn African.

    I ran you through Eurogenes K=36 to roughly gauge your more "recent" ancestries as K=7 just gives us an idea of your basal and really pre-historic ancestry (How "ANE" you are, how "African" you are etc.) :


    In this case you seem extremely similar to both Deft & the Bravanese fellow. You're roughly ~20% South to South-Central Asian, ~40-50% Horn African, 1-5% Southeast African Bantu & I'd say something like 10-20% (or more) West Asian (I assume no doubt a mix of Iranian and Arab).

    Needed to be sure of some of these estimates though so they need to be corroborated with the results from other calculators (and preferably even some useful PCA positions but I can't have anyone run you through a PCA as of now, apologies):


    I've seen enough calculator results to be pretty sure that just like Deft and the Bravanese chap that you're roughly ~20% "South Asian". Hell, for the two of them, even ancestryDNA (for Deft) and 23andme for the Bravanese bro caught on to their ~20% South Asian ancestry like the below 23andme ancestry painting for the Bravanese hombre:



    I don't know why but all three of you have notable South to South-Central Asian ancestry, enough to be roughly ~10% South Indian/ASI... As for the estimates of Horn African/Somali ancestry they click well with your African scores the same way I explained here in regards to Deftextra and the Bravanese akhi's results (quick hint now; you're 30-40% "African" and a Somali is ~60% African... If we assume you're 1-10% Southeast African Bantu, although you show remarkably low levels of such ancestry in K=36 compared to Deft and co., then the "African" that roughly remains is half the amount of "African" ancestry a Somali would have which fits with you being ~40-50% Somali/Horn African derived). But, even in other calculators where some Horner clusters have formed you show signs of substantial Horn African ancestry:



    PuntDNAL K=15


    These two runs aren't as pristine as Eurogenes K=36 where we have a pretty strong "Horn African" cluster in "Northeast African" and another one ("East African") that Somalis and the like show due to the notorious calculator effect but it's one that peaks in Maasais who are part "Cushitic" themselves. Somalis also show "Middle Eastern Herder" or "Southwest Asian" in those two runs like I do below:

    Sheikh Awale 1



    So basically some of your "Southwest Asian" among scores for other clusters are likely partially derived from Horn African ancestry (you're free to look at the Punt K=15 population averages here) but both these calculators do imply well over 30% Somali/Horn African related ancestry and I have no real reason at this point to doubt that you're unlike Deft and Bravanese guy and about ~40-50% "Somali/Horn African".


    In regards to your Southeast African Bantu related ancestry... I honestly cannot be as "exact" as with the other ancestries. Mostly because a lot of runs at Gedmatch and such are pretty stricken with the calculator effect and Somalis too will show "West African" related ancestry or what have you when in actuality; we don't truly have such ancestry... Our "African" ancestry is much more rooted in Eastern Africa and is related to the non-West-Central African/Niger-Congo related elements in peoples like the Dinka). K=36 is just about the only run I could find where Somalis turn up as 0% "West African/Niger-Congo" or what have you and your levels of such ancestry are surprisingly low in comparison to Deft and the Bravanese chico. You may indeed be notably less SE African Bantu derived than them... Perhaps just around 1-5%? At most 1-10%, I would say.

    What remains after the Horn African, South Asian and SE Bantu-related ancestry is accounted for would be your West Asian ancestry, I wager. One can't be 100% sure if this ancestry is mostly derived from Arabs or Iranians, you're really just too complexly mixed for something like ADMIXTURE to properly pin-point that kind of detail perfectly imho. Though I'm guessing you have both Arab and Iranian roots in regards to your West Asian elements. I think you may have tiny hints of European ancestry though your ANE K=7 WHG-UHG scores kind of imply that you don't really have any or have almost none (that run strongly inflates people's WHG-UHG scores yet you're still at a level below 5%), whatever "European" affinities you show could honestly be derived from your South to South-Central Asian ancestry given the Indo-Iranian migrations.

    Your Oracle-4 results and mixed modes are interesting and much like Deftextra's imply Horn African, Arab& Iranian, Southeast African Bantu & South to South-Central Asian roots:



    Eurogenes Jtest


    Future testing with formal stats and PCAs would be great but I'd say much of the above is pretty conclusive...


    After seeing your results... I'd say Deftextra is likely correct and you chaps (Reer Xamars) are most likely going to turn out relatively homogeneous. Three dudes of three different groups from a paternal perspective turning out so similar, it's a bit much (plus, I recall Deft mentioning a few other Reer Xamars he encountered on AncestryDNA and they seemed quite like him). But all three of you are quite related, although I expect this to be the case for much of your community.

    At this juncture you maybe wondering why I sometimes refer to your substantial "Somali" ancestry as Horn African (adopting a more broad label)? It's because I've been doing a lot of re-reading into the history of the south from the Classical Period when the Himyarites and Eastern Cushitic speaking Azanians were present to the Medieval Period arrival of Arab, Iranian and South Asian travelers (who more or less, from what I gather, founded the likes of Mogadishu and/or took over the reigns from settlements established by the Himyarites and perhaps inhabited by them and the Azanians) to the eventual rule of actual Somalis/Barbaras who migrated from the north (the Ajuran) and I have a feeling you guys are not 40-50% "Somali" per say but in fact ~40-50% pre-Somali Eastern Cushite:

     
    The south's history is pretty complicated and intricate but I'll go into some important beats.

    Ancient to Classical/Antiquity Periods:


    The region is eventually over-run by expanding Eastern Cushites from the hinterlands of Ethiopia, these people would've possibly or probably been speakers of "Oromoid" & "Macro-Somali" or "Somali" languages like one likely to be ancestral to Maay, Tunni, Garre, Jiiddu (all of which aren't mutually intelligible with North/Standard Somali and have what look to be notable Oromoid influences) and they would've over-run the original seemingly "San" related Hunter-Gatherer peoples of the south (Cushitizing them like with the Eyle), seemingly bringing farming and pastoralism to the region.

    The Greco-Romans & others looked to know these folk and other seemingly also East to perhaps also South Cushites in Southern Somalia and regions more south (like Southeast Africa) as "The Azanians". It's interesting tbh that outsiders labelled differently from the "Barbaroi" of Northern Somalia (Somalis' original homeland prior to them likely, as per linguistic evidence, migrating to the region around ~2,500 to 3,000 years ago from the hinterlands of Ethiopia) but anyway, the Periplus of the Erythraean Sea which is a key source alluding to the early political dominance of Himyar along Southern Somalia's coastline, also claims that the "Arabs" (in fact Southern Arabians who would've spoken languages like Himyaritic and not "Arabic") of Himyar interacted, traded and supposedly intermixed with these "large stature-d" folk (Basically tall... This is something, btw, which has been somewhat proven via archaeology in that a lot of these people referred to as "Azanians" like those in Northern Kenya were seemingly quite tall so the Greco-Romans weren't supposedly fibbing about their "big stature"), these Azanians also apparently indulged in some piracy along the coast whilst trading with the outside world as early as the 1st Century CE. You can read much of this via the Periplus yourself via this link.

    Medieval Period:

    I'd say the early Medieval Period is characterized by various outside peoples migrating to the Benadir coast (Arabs (probably not just of Peninsular Arabian origins btw), Iranians, Indians etc.) and founding the earliest Post-Classical forms of ports like Mogadishu, Barawa and so on and probably to some extent took over the reigns of what the Himyarites and co. supposedly left behind. For a time Mogadishu comes under the control of the Caliphates (can't quite remember which one tbh, murky on this right now) but around the 11th to 13th centuries we start seeing signs that Somalis are beginning to inhabit the region. I.e. various "Arab" sources allude to their presence like the Hawiye being mentioned as living in villages along what is assumed to be the Shebelle's banks close to Merca or even some sources claiming that Merca is "The Capital of the Hawiye" during the 12th century (1100s), alluding to them, to actual Somalis, beginning to inhabit some of these coastal towns and/or areas near them. Read some of this to see some of the sources who mention the Hawiye.

    The Ajuran's dominance in much of the south grows during the 13th century and onward, and by about 1331 (14th century) when Ibn Battuta visited Mogadishu; he notes that the Sultan of the city is basically a Somali/Barbara (a dark-skinned ("negro") people who herd camels and sheep and also look to dominate northern ports like Zeila as well as all the land between Zeila to Mogadishu according to Battuta. At this juncture in time, the Arabs knew much of the Somali Peninsula as "Bilad al-Barbar" (Country of the Berbers)) but alludes, I suppose to clearly other presences still being in the city like when he notes that the Sultan's main legal advisor is an Egyptian. Most of the history from this point on should be obvious to most people who've consulted even a rudimentary source like Wikipedia so I won't go on.

    ------


    One important thing to take from all this are the "Sab" Somalis / various members of the Raxanweyn clan who have their own languages like the Tunni, Jiiddu and Garre. These folk differ from the 4 main Somali clans in life-style. In the North people mainly subsisted throughout history via trade and pastoral nomadism mostly due to the largely non-arable nature of much of the north. If Northerners ever "farmed" it would've been in regions that were fertile enough such as areas much more to the west and around Eastern Ethiopia (Hararghe area etc.) where groups like the Geri Darod were noted by chaps like Enrico Cerulli to be practicing some rudimentary farming along with pastoralism for quite some time and indeed when he encountered them during his travels. But otherwise, establishing trade port-towns across the Northern coast and inland towns and villages (some of which I would say were clearly also inhabited by Southern Ethio-Semitic speakers based on both archaeological and linguistic evidence), fishing, sea-faring and of course good ol' pastoral nomadism (the dominant occupation, I would say) would be the only practical ways to survive in such a region. This honestly wouldn't have been incredibly different from the life-styles led by various peoples on the Arabian Peninsula (if we discount more fertile areas like Yemen). Heck, when I look at Early Modern pictures of the UAE, the life-style I see reminds of what I've noticed in Northern Somalia around the same time. Granted, the North was pretty impoverished at this point in time compared to the past thanks to the Portuguese' vicious raids, the collapse and/or waning of entities of entities like the Adal and Warsangali and the eventual presence of powers like the Ottomans and British. Very much a shell of its former self.

    These seemingly "original southerners" are different though... They quite widely practice sedentary farming alongside pastoralism (no doubt thanks to how fertile the south is compared to the much more barren north. Hell, my own Raxanweyn maternal great grandmother, whom I owe my mtDNA to, comes from a farming family). I.e. the Tunni are primarily farmers and as I mention here, I suspect some of these groups might have "Omotic-related" influences given the seemingly Oromo influences in their languages. Although, I so far haven't seen much evidence of this... At any rate, these people whilst very closely related to Somalis and linguistically linked to them aren't necessarily truly "Somalis" like those of the four main pastoral clans, they're "Somali" in a much more "ancient" sense and their ancestors probably split from those of the 4 clans a long while back (perhaps not much earlier than when Somalis' ancestors split from the likes of Oromos? Granted, some admixture from the later encroaching Somalis of the north who came to politically & demographically dominate the south in time might be present for all we know).

    The Sheikh(moi)'s current theory is that you chaps MIGHT derive your "Somali" ancestry from these chaps. I.e. Baraawe's principal inhabitants alongside the "Bravanese/Reer Baraawe" have seemingly been the Tunni, as even a source as rudimentary as Wikipedia will note. My contention for example is that whatever substantial Somali-related ancestry the "Bravanese" have is likely mostly derived from the Tunni or people like them and not actual Somalis like the Hawiye who seemingly only began migrating to the south during the Middle Ages. In my humble opinion, "Benadiris" might be the result of early (Medieval) inter-mixture between various diverse migrants of Iranian, Arab and South to South-Central Asian descent who intermixed with the pre-Somali Lowland East Cushitic speaking peoples of the south like the ancestors of the Tunni or people like them. This might explain why you guys look so substantially "Somali" or "Horn African" despite not being aware of strong early inter-mixture (there is some more recent intermixing as your brother claims your grandmother or great grandmother is a Somali for example) with actual ethnic Somalis who only came to be dominant in the south supposedly after some of your non-Cushitic ancestors' migrations to the region. For all we know, the "dark-skinned Berber" inhabitants of Mogadishu whom Yaqut al-Hammawi refers to as early as the 12th century may not have entirely been actual Somalis but been Tunni-esque peoples living in the settlement alongside other diverse inhabitants with actual Somalis only joining just a little later. But who knows...

    I got an early hint of this when I noticed that Deftextra only has one Somali relative/match on Gedmatch (albeit one should note the somewhat greater scarcity of samples from Southern Somalia as a whole) and that's a Garre dude from Moyale (the Ethiopian side of the town). This Garre's ancestral location is rather off but the Garre are basically linguistically one of these Raxanweyn groups with their own language and I don't think it's a coincidence that Deft matched with one of them.



    All in all, the above theory could be completely wrong but I suspect this may turn out to be the case and that you chaps are the result of early or perhaps gradual intermixing between outside settlers and these Pre-Somali Cushitic peoples who already occupied the south (with perhaps some input from actual Somalis given that peoples like Reer Xamars did ultimately linguistically shift to Somali and of course some definite input from Bantu speakers... Reer Baraawe are Swahili speakers for example. Some input from the native Hunter-Gatherers of Southern Somalia might also be present) in a manner perhaps somewhat mimicking what the Greeks claimed was going on between the Himyarites and Azanians. I hope all this and your results have been informative and well... Take care, mayne. Take some time to read all of the above and ask whatever questions you wish to ask here, via email or PM (whatever floats your boat). I wrote a bit of a goddamned doctoral thesis above (lol) but I shared much of it (like the historical stuff) for Deftextra and not just you.

    Forgive minor mistakes that maybe present in this post... It's quite a hulking piece and I'm frankly pretty tired right about now.
    Last edited by Awale; 01-17-2016 at 02:33 AM.
    فار عارابإ آ واجإب اه

  18. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Awale For This Useful Post:

     Agamemnon (01-17-2016),  Deftextra (01-17-2016),  drobbah (01-18-2016),  Lank (01-17-2016),  Morci (01-17-2016)

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