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Thread: DF27, aka S250, results from the Chromo2 test

  1. #1
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    DF27, aka S250, results from the Chromo2 test

    There have been significant threads, and lists of the people testing, for U106 and L21, maybe others; but I haven't seen anything of similar substance regarding DF27. Maybe I've just missed it. There was this one thread, on which Corner (DF27+ and Z196-) mentions that he ordered Chromo2 in mid-July:

    http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthre...NPs-for-R-P312

    And separately I've mentioned that some British L165 guys are getting ten new SNPs out of that test. I have no idea who they are, though. I think the Bonesetter Project may have ongoing research interest in this area. Has anybody else ordered Chromo2, from our DF27 haplogroup? Probably we should have a thread for it, now that results are coming in.

    Also, they're saying the Chromo2 turnaround time now is 6-8 weeks (probably, from the time they have your sample). So those of us who think of DNA tests as a Christmas present to ourselves (possibly because FTDNA runs a sale at that time of year) might order now, and get a bunch of new SNPs from Santa Claus. Just a suggestion, not really a recommendation. [I'm also interested in the FTDNA winter sale; announcements to be made at their annual admin conference next month; the hints of new (and less expensive) tests from Full Genomes -- and other fast-moving events.] But if your spouse only lets you depart from budget once or twice a year, for this hobby, now is a good time to think about it.

  2. #2
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    I'm still waiting for Chromo2 results, the schedule for the first batch was going to be the end of September but this has been delayed by a few weeks. I got an email from BritainsDNA saying results from the first batch should start to be delivered between 21st of October (tomorrow) and the 8th of November.

    It's interesting that L165 are getting results from Chromo2 now. I think L165 are DF27/Z196+, but the bone setter is DF27/Z196-.

    The STR cluster who's off-modal markers I match over 111 markers is looking DF27+ and negative for Z196 and all other presently known SNPs under DF27. BritainsDNA have the 13 novel SNPs under S250/DF27 from the Anglesey bone setter project in their Chromo2 test, so if we match any of them it should show up. The bone setter project report (2012) stated that those SNPs are very rare in the British Isles and weren't found in anyone else in BritainsDNA's database, so I'm not sure of our chances.

    There have been no definite high resolution matches to our cluster from outside the British Isles and Ireland until a recent 111 marker match from Sweden. Last week another new 60/67 marker match from Sweden appeared on my FTDNA 67 marker homepage too. There was also a new 111 marker Rox2 match with origins in Normandy recently. I don't know if any other DF27* people have ordered Chromo2. A fellow cluster match has Full Genomes results due any time as well so fingers crossed we should know more soon one way or the other.

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     Gray Fox (10-21-2013)

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    Any other DF27 people with Chromo 2 orders pending or results in?

    We need to keep a list and collect/share the raw results as they come in

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    I have ordered the Chromo2 test - Corden B3990 - Z214+ Z279-

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikewww View Post
    Any other DF27 people with Chromo 2 orders pending or results in?

    We need to keep a list and collect/share the raw results as they come in
    Mike, I just uploaded my Chromo2 Raw YDNA test results data file (fB2323 Gibault) into the Yahoo Chromo2 DF27/S250 results folder yesterday...

    - Roger -
    FTDNA: B2323 Ysearch: B3W4E
    Paternal Ancestor: Gabriel Gibault, 1641-1700, Lusignan, France
    Maternal Ancestor: Susannah Hunt, 1739-1785, New Jersey

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    Quote Originally Posted by GabeGibeau View Post
    Mike, I just uploaded my Chromo2 Raw YDNA test results data file (fB2323 Gibault) into the Yahoo Chromo2 DF27/S250 results folder yesterday...

    - Roger -
    Looks like you've got all of Mikol Ryon's SNPs in the Z220 area. But he's got PF6780 / F411 and you've got S21184 and S334 / L277. I had an L277 come up in U106, so I don't know if it is an unstable SNP or an unreliable test. L277 is testable at FTDNA.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidCar View Post
    Looks like you've got all of Mikol Ryon's SNPs in the Z220 area. But he's got PF6780 / F411 and you've got S21184 and S334 / L277. I had an L277 come up in U106, so I don't know if it is an unstable SNP or an unreliable test. L277 is testable at FTDNA.
    Now the evidence suggests you don't have S344, and that all raw data before last week had GG-negative, and all raw data after last week will have AG-negative.

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     GabeGibeau (01-19-2014)

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    I'm looking at what I think is a newly posted Chromo2 file for B2323 Gibault, who already had a Geno2 test posted in our R1b-DF27 project -- so it's the first side by side comparison I've seen (of the positive results only, from Geno2). Anyway it's hard enough finding the parallel nomenclature for these SNPs (of some interest for the phylogeny of the old North/South cluster), and I thought it might be useful to list them somewhere. Geno2 (FTDNA) name on the left, Chromo2 name on the right:
    Z220 S356
    Z295 S1217
    CTS4065 S1221
    Z270 Z270
    Z210 *
    CTS12074 S8070
    Z216 Z216
    Z278 *

    The asterisks indicate a couple of SNPs I didn't find on the Chromo2 list, though that may only mean I still don't know what else they are called. The Notes section of the ISOGG R tree is very helpful, especially for SNPs not yet placed on the tree -- but only if somebody has told them the alternate name(s). The ones I have listed here apparently work, on Chromo2. Not all of them are found/working on Geno2, but most are.

  12. #9
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    There is a new thread on this topic more broadly, that links to a large spreadsheet of data just released: http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthre...2-Results-Data

    I have been trying to mine it for information pertinent to DF27. This is to some extent an update of the previous two posts, above, but it will contain a lot more detail.

    The format of the Chromo2 results spreadsheet only lends itself to one name for a SNP, in most (but not all) cases the S-series used by that lab, BISDNA. There are over 14,000 SNPs listed, with a row for each; and there are 2,000 columns, each representing a unique sample with some SNP called for it. This isn't necessarily the "terminal" SNP for the sample in question, though it's a good hint to it. Anyway, I want to include known subclades of DF27 in the total for that level, and then break down the numbers as possible for several of its identified subclades. I'll use two or more names for most SNPs.

    R1b S116/P312: DF27/S250 Columns AHF through AJO, (62) samples not broken down further
    Z214/S348: AJP (1)
    Z196/S355: AJQ-AKH (18)
    Z209/S230 = Z220/S356: AKI-ALE (23), plus some grouped elsewhere: AJP, AFV, AFW (3) = total (26)
    [Z295 has not been found on the Chromo2 chip, but is below Z220 and above the next two]
    CTS4065/S1221 (under Z220): AKM, AKQ, AKS, AKX, AKZ, ALA, ALC (7)
    Z270 (under Z220): AKI, AJP, AFV, AFW (4)
    Z278/S181: AFV, AFW (2)
    DF17/S455: not found [edit: I am informed that S229 may substitute for DF17: AGD-AGJ (7)]
    L165/S68: BWJ-BWU (12)
    SRY2627/S251: BWV-BXL (17)

    Counting only the totals in bold (because the listed subclade members are included in them) that makes 142 known DF27 samples, out of 2,000 -- or 7.10% of the not especially random, mostly Isles-origin population represented in this Chromo2-tested sample. Of the 80 examples identified more specifically than DF27/S250, there are 26 on the Z220 side, 29 on the L176.2 side, 7 presumed DF17, and 18 elsewhere (unspecified) in the Z196 branch. That leaves 62 more, 44% of the DF27 total, not yet accounted for more specifically. It may just be a matter of my not yet knowing what else BISDNA calls them; or perhaps they are hiding in places I haven't looked. Anyway, this is a start. It will get more complex before it gets simpler.
    Last edited by razyn; 02-20-2014 at 10:55 PM.

  13. #10
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    Attempting to delete duplicate content.
    Last edited by razyn; 02-24-2014 at 05:37 AM.

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