Page 2 of 75 FirstFirst 12341252 ... LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 744

Thread: Broushaki et al. "Early Neolithic genomes from the eastern Fertile Crescent"

  1. #11
    Registered Users
    Posts
    363
    Sex
    Location
    Erebuni
    Ethnicity
    Armenian Urartian
    Y-DNA
    J1

    Armenia
    Mfa
    Scythians in Transcaucasia had much earlier presence. Their state Sacasen in Kura valley or Askanaz in Bible is attested quite early. Those Schythians in Kura valley were a constant source of problems for Urartu.


    That Neolithic map is fine
    They even noted Shulaveri. I hope we will see aDNA from Shulaveri culture.
    Last edited by Arame; 07-15-2016 at 08:29 AM.

  2. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Arame For This Useful Post:

     Hando (07-16-2016), MfA (07-15-2016)

  3. #12
    Registered Users
    Posts
    1,025
    Sex
    Ethnicity
    Kurd
    Y-DNA
    E-M84>FGC18388
    mtDNA
    J1b3b

    Ayyubid Dynasty Zand Dynasty Ararat Republic Mahabad Republic Kurdistan Rojavaya Kurdistane
    Quote Originally Posted by Arame View Post
    Mfa
    Scythians in Transcaucasia had much earlier presence. Their state Sacasen in Kura valley or Askanaz in Bible is attested quite early. Those Schythians in Kura valley were a constant source of problems for Urartu.
    Yeah they were at north of Urartu around 10th c. BC. They seem to be few and weak and harrased and enslaved by Urartians which eventually forced them to unite and form larger military. eventually lead the major invasion the Scythian state with capitol around Saqqez 7th century BC.


    http://grbs.library.duke.edu/article...oad/10701/4291
    Last edited by MfA; 07-18-2016 at 05:15 PM.
    E-M84>Y5435>Y5412>FGC18389>FGC18401>FGC18388 tMRCA 3000ybp

  4. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to MfA For This Useful Post:

     Hando (07-16-2016), kingjohn (07-15-2016), palamede (08-04-2016), Tomenable (07-16-2016)

  5. #13
    Registered Users
    Posts
    567
    Sex
    Y-DNA
    C-M217
    mtDNA
    M8a

    Kyrgyzstan
    One very good thing about the paper: among authors there are scientists from Iran, so we can hope for further collaboration of Iranian archaeologists with aDNA laboratories.

  6. The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to rozenfeld For This Useful Post:

     Arame (07-15-2016), Hando (07-16-2016), Jean M (07-15-2016), Kopfjäger (07-15-2016), persian (07-16-2016), Tomenable (07-16-2016)

  7. #14
    Gold Class Member
    Posts
    3,715
    Sex
    Ethnicity
    N/A
    Nationality
    N/A
    Y-DNA
    I2a1-L621- PH 908
    mtDNA
    H 47

    One thing that strikes me is that the Iron Age Iranian sample, despite its northern connections (ie being Z2103), is not very steppe shifted, but lies on a Anatolian- Iran Chalcolithic continuum. It also hints that much of the ANE -type admixture over and above pre-existing ancient/ Neoliithic element probably arrived with historic Turks rather than Bronze Age steppe

  8. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Gravetto-Danubian For This Useful Post:

     Hando (07-16-2016), Megalophias (07-15-2016)

  9. #15
    Registered Users
    Posts
    1,025
    Sex
    Ethnicity
    Kurd
    Y-DNA
    E-M84>FGC18388
    mtDNA
    J1b3b

    Ayyubid Dynasty Zand Dynasty Ararat Republic Mahabad Republic Kurdistan Rojavaya Kurdistane
    The Ethno-Linguistic Character of Northwestern Iran and Kurdistan in the Neo-Assyrian Period - Ran Zadok



    1.MANNAEA AND ADJACENT REGIONS
    Linguistic analysis of the anthroponymy

    Linguistic analysis of the toponymy

    If one can rely on the restricted onomastic sample (27 anthroponyms), only in Mannea and its environs, which were on the Urartian border, were the Hurro-Urartians the second-largest group (1-4 individuals = 14.8-3.7 percent, compared with one individual with a Kassite name = 3.7 percent). Although only four out of 27 anthroponyms (14.81 percent) are Old Iranian (see Zadok, 2002a, p. 25), they form the largest group. The ethnic characterization of Mannea naturally refers only to its ruling class, as very few commoners’ names are mentioned in the sources. The evidence for the ethnolinguistic character of the Manneans (843-ca. 600 BCE) was conveniently summarized by Boehmer (1964). His conclusions were generally accepted (cf. Kashkai, 1977, esp. chap. 2). Boehmer is of the opinion that the Manneans were a Hurrian group with a slight Kassite admixture (cf. Kashkai, 1977, pp. 39 f. with lit.). It is unlikely that there was any ethnolinguistic unity in Mannea. Like other peoples of the Iranian plateau, the Manneans were subjected to an ever increasing Iranian (i.e., Indo-European) penetration. Boehmer’s analysis of several anthroponyms and toponyms needs modification and augmentation. Melikishvili (1949, p. 60) tried to confine the Iranian presence in Mannea to its periphery, pointing out that both Daiukku (cf. Schmitt, 1973) and Bagdatti were active in the periphery of Mannea, but this is imprecise, in view of the fact that the names of two early Mannean rulers, viz. Udaki and Azā, are explicable in Old Iranian terms.
    http://www.iranicaonline.org/articles/mannea
    Last edited by MfA; 07-15-2016 at 10:56 AM.
    E-M84>Y5435>Y5412>FGC18389>FGC18401>FGC18388 tMRCA 3000ybp

  10. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to MfA For This Useful Post:

     palamede (08-04-2016), Tomenable (07-16-2016)

  11. #16
    Moderator
    Posts
    2,707
    Sex
    Location
    USA
    Ethnicity
    Italo-Iberian
    Nationality
    American
    Y-DNA
    R1b-U152+ L2+
    mtDNA
    H4a1

    United States of America Italy Spain
    Quote Originally Posted by Gravetto-Danubian View Post
    One thing that strikes me is that the Iron Age Iranian sample, despite its northern connections (ie being Z2103), is not very steppe shifted, but lies on a Anatolian- Iran Chalcolithic continuum. It also hints that much of the ANE -type admixture over and above pre-existing ancient/ Neoliithic element probably arrived with historic Turks rather than Bronze Age steppe
    There is a long time gap to fill between the Copper Age steppe R1b and the Iranian Iron Age sample, so I don't think too much can be said from an autosomal perspective. Too much time for admixture. Besides, the authors said Anatolia was a more likely contributor than the steppe... but I am pretty sure the Iron Age sample will have its fair share of steppe components.

    Also, remember the way that I2 behaved in Europe: it started off as 100% WHG and then came out as heavily EEF. That does not mean I2 originated in Anatolia.
    Last edited by R.Rocca; 07-15-2016 at 10:38 AM.
    Paternal: R1b-U152+ L2+ ZZ48+ FGC10543+, Pietro della Rocca, b. 1559, Agira, Sicily, Italy
    Maternal: Haplogroup H4a1-T152C!, Maria Coto, b. ~1864, Asturias, Spain
    Mother's Paternal: Haplogroup J1+ FGC4745/FGC4766+ PF5019+, Gerardo Caprio, b. 1879, Caposele, Avellino, Campania, Italy
    Father's Maternal: Haplogroup T2b-C150T, Francisca Santa Cruz, b.1916, Garganchon, Burgos, Spain

    Avatar: Raetian bronze votive, Fritzens-Sanzeno Culture VI-V c. BC, Trentino-Alto Adige/Südtirol, Italy

  12. The Following 10 Users Say Thank You to R.Rocca For This Useful Post:

     Arame (07-15-2016), ffoucart (07-15-2016), Hando (07-16-2016), jdean (07-15-2016), Jean M (07-15-2016), Kopfjäger (07-15-2016), Michał (07-15-2016), parasar (07-15-2016), rms2 (07-15-2016), rozenfeld (07-15-2016)

  13. #17
    Gold Class Member
    Posts
    3,715
    Sex
    Ethnicity
    N/A
    Nationality
    N/A
    Y-DNA
    I2a1-L621- PH 908
    mtDNA
    H 47

    Delete
    Last edited by Gravetto-Danubian; 07-15-2016 at 10:55 AM. Reason: Double

  14. #18
    Gold Class Member
    Posts
    3,715
    Sex
    Ethnicity
    N/A
    Nationality
    N/A
    Y-DNA
    I2a1-L621- PH 908
    mtDNA
    H 47

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard A. Rocca View Post
    There is a long time gap to fill between the Copper Age steppe R1b and the Iranian Iron Age sample, so I don't think too much can be said from an autosomal perspective. Too much time for admiture. Besides, the authors said Anatolia was a more likely contributor than the steppe... but I am pretty sure the Iron Age sample will have its fair share of steppe components.

    Also, remember the way that I2 behaved in Europe, it started off as 100% WHG and then came out as heavily EEF. That does not mean I2 originated in Anatolia.
    That's certainly true Rich, but my point wasn't that Z2103 is from from Anatolia or Iran, in fact I've opined to the contrary several times
    Rather, it appears that - at a population level- there doesn't appear to have been much of a Bronze Age impact from the steppe to Iran (& and this is from northwest Iran c 900 BC), so a good time for *proto-Iranians. Sure, we don't have actual Bronze Age genomes from Iran, but IIRC the Iranians are supposed to have arrived in the late bronze / early Iron Age; so there isn't actually much of gap, and I will predict that BA Iranians will also lie on the same continuum. (Ie not deviate too wildly).

    In essence, the major shifts in Iran occurred in the copper age, not in the Andronovo phase

    So it'll be interesting what data India pulls out, soon
    Last edited by Gravetto-Danubian; 07-15-2016 at 10:59 AM.

  15. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Gravetto-Danubian For This Useful Post:

     Hando (07-16-2016), jdean (07-15-2016), parasar (07-15-2016), R.Rocca (07-15-2016)

  16. #19
    Registered Users
    Posts
    4,706

    "derived lactase persistence - associated alleles in 3 of the 5 individuals ... Because this is an unexpected result, we examined these positions in greater detail using samtools tview. Analysis of the specific read groups from which these reads derived along with their base quality and mapping scores did not show signs of contamination. ... the small number of derived reads ... leads us to suspect they may be erroneous."

  17. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to parasar For This Useful Post:

     K33 (07-18-2016), Tomenable (07-16-2016)

  18. #20
    Registered Users
    Posts
    1,960
    Sex
    Y-DNA
    R1b-DF27 FGC17112
    mtDNA
    H5a1

    I'm hoping to have the data soon, so I'll check them out. I think the big thing here is that the Iron Age sample being on the EN to Anatolian cline is important. The Chl samples are Levantine shifted, so I think we'll see pretty significant amount of Armenian Bronze Age ancestry here.

  19. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Chad Rohlfsen For This Useful Post:

     Gravetto-Danubian (07-15-2016), Hando (07-16-2016), kingjohn (07-15-2016), Tomenable (07-16-2016)

Page 2 of 75 FirstFirst 12341252 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 172
    Last Post: 07-21-2017, 08:57 PM
  2. Replies: 4
    Last Post: 01-10-2016, 11:57 PM
  3. Replies: 110
    Last Post: 07-03-2015, 08:36 PM
  4. Early Fertile Crescent Neolithic Y-DNA
    By J Man in forum Ancient (aDNA)
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 02-26-2015, 10:38 PM
  5. Replies: 27
    Last Post: 06-15-2014, 08:11 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •