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Thread: Why would a British person get low Great Britain ?

  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by sktibo View Post
    I do certainly think the SE English are more Anglo-Saxon than the Northumbrians are, not sure about most. It looks like Devon actually has a slightly higher percentage of Anglo and Saxon categories from the POBI, but less other admixture. This reminds me of a conversation I had with an individual named Calas who would insist that the POBI wasn't a very reliable study and they knew best on these issues. Gee... sure has been a while since "Calas" popped up and made an appearance, and they sure did like to post under a lot of different usernames....
    sktibo - Calas? Is that supposed to mean something to me or do you throw that name at anyone who disagrees with you? Nor did I say POBI was wrong, I said you were. Are you a POBI researcher now? You never said you were getting your information off the POBI - could you quote the exact facts saying this - just sort of throwing it out there.


    Quote Originally Posted by sktibo View Post
    I'm not really interested in having this discussion further.. the bottom line is, the current major study on the British Isles claims Northumbria isn't as Anglo Saxon influenced as the Southeast English are, and until something else of that scale comes out that says otherwise that's what we have to go on.

    Now about the maps you've posted, Northumbria has a higher Scandinavian influence than southern England does, and that's more likely why you see that correlation there
    Hmmm, who do you think the Anglo-Saxons were? And what do you know of Scandinavian history? Thing is, a rather well respected genetic researcher, an individual who is knighted for his work, once said they can't tell the difference between Denmark raiders & Anglo-Saxons of the olden years cause they're almost one and the same.

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  3. #62
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    Regarding Anglo-Saxon genetic input, probably the most reliable way of measuring this is to compare ancient Anglo-Saxon DNA with modern populations. We don't have much in the way of Anglo-Saxon genomes but we do have the one from that paper about Roman gladiators and the box plot here (b) shows that East Anglians are closest to the Anglo-Saxon. Historically, I think this would make sense.

    The North of England (which is basically Northumbria in this study) on the box plot is further away from the Anglo-Saxon closer to Wales, again this would make sense historically as Celtic survival always looked to be higher in the north compared to south and east of England.


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    Quote Originally Posted by avalon View Post
    Regarding Anglo-Saxon genetic input, probably the most reliable way of measuring this is to compare ancient Anglo-Saxon DNA with modern populations. We don't have much in the way of Anglo-Saxon genomes but we do have the one from that paper about Roman gladiators and the box plot here (b) shows that East Anglians are closest to the Anglo-Saxon. Historically, I think this would make sense.

    The North of England (which is basically Northumbria in this study) on the box plot is further away from the Anglo-Saxon closer to Wales, again this would make sense historically as Celtic survival always looked to be higher in the north compared to south and east of England.

    Very interesting Avalon, thank you for sharing that. I didn't know there were other studies that looked at this topic in such detail. Is East Midlands referring to Lincolnshire area?
    Paper trail ancestry to the best of my knowledge:
    English 28.12%, German 18.75%, Scottish 17.96%, Irish (mostly lowland Scottish origin) 12.5%, French 8.2%, Eastern European 6.25%, Welsh 3.125%, Native American 1.95%, and Colonial American, 3.125%, which cannot be determined with complete certainty: there is Dutch (at least 1.36%) and some English. The rest could include Spanish, Norwegian, German, French, and Native American, but these percentages would be minuscule.

  6. #64
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    Ancestry is pretty poor on this.
    I am 50% west Europe, 18% Irish and only 13% Great Britain plus Scandinavia 11%, Iberia 4%, Finnish 3%, North Africa 1%
    So in the past 6000 years probably correct. Certainly not recent which makes them an improvement over 23&me who had German and Finnish inputs in the 1800s
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Out of 64 pre 1800 births 44% Cheshire, 1% Worcestershire, 1% Scottish (or Irish), 25% south Derbyshire, 13% Burton on Trent area (where 4 counties within 10 miles), 7% Shropshire, 1% Staffs, 8% Lancs

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    Quote Originally Posted by sktibo View Post
    Very interesting Avalon, thank you for sharing that. I didn't know there were other studies that looked at this topic in such detail. Is East Midlands referring to Lincolnshire area?
    Well the paper was mainly about Roman York but they did have the one Anglo-Saxon genome so it's a start.

    I would say the East Midlands region might refer to Lincolnshire but also Derbyshire, Nottinghamshire and Leicestershire. I don't know precisely where the modern data used this study comes from although I know it is not POBI.

    RegionalMap2.gif

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  10. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Judith View Post
    Ancestry is pretty poor on this.
    I am 50% west Europe, 18% Irish and only 13% Great Britain plus Scandinavia 11%, Iberia 4%, Finnish 3%, North Africa 1%
    So in the past 6000 years probably correct.s
    BUT certainly not in line with the Ancestry work posted by Don Felipe in post 7 of this thread http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthre...-across-Europe which would indicate that I should be 41% to 37% Great Britain not their 13% nor the accurate 100%!
    So they have an algorithm problem or a sample base one.
    Unsurprisingly my close confirmed matches have similar West Europe or Finnish ethnicity too.
    Out of 64 pre 1800 births 44% Cheshire, 1% Worcestershire, 1% Scottish (or Irish), 25% south Derbyshire, 13% Burton on Trent area (where 4 counties within 10 miles), 7% Shropshire, 1% Staffs, 8% Lancs

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sikeliot View Post
    This is my opinion: Ancestry.com poorly chose a very Anglo-Saxon influenced part of England to be the 'Great Britain' reference population, which makes the less Anglo-Saxon parts of England come up more Irish, as well as the Scottish and Welsh scoring higher Ireland. The Irish component is likely the more indigenous one in the British isles, and it would have been more meaningful to have "Great Britain" be centered on a more indigenous part of the UK, which would reduce the amount of Irish that the British are scoring.
    I agree that is why I have been using the British category of AncestryDNA as synonymous with Anglo-Saxon for as long as I can remember. I score 37% British/Anglo-Saxon on ancestryDNA and I have Irish, English, West German(ic) (Alsace-Lorraine) and Scottish ancestry most likely. It seems the west German(ic) just went into the Norman/Saxon DNA of the British category to a significant degree or for the most part. I dunno why the west German(ic) from Alsace-Lorraine is not showing up as west European.
    Last edited by Teutorigos; 09-12-2017 at 10:19 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sktibo View Post
    Interesting... did I say that? I'm not sure that I did.
    I do certainly think the SE English are more Anglo-Saxon than the Northumbrians are, not sure about most. It looks like Devon actually has a slightly higher percentage of Anglo and Saxon categories from the POBI, but less other admixture.

    This reminds me of a conversation I had with an individual named Calas who would insist that the POBI wasn't a very reliable study and they knew best on these issues.
    Gee... sure has been a while since "Calas" popped up and made an appearance, and they sure did like to post under a lot of different usernames....

    I'm not really interested in having this discussion further.. the bottom line is, the current major study on the British Isles claims Northumbria isn't as Anglo Saxon influenced as the Southeast English are, and until something else of that scale comes out that says otherwise that's what we have to go on.

    Now about the maps you've posted, Northumbria has a higher Scandinavian influence than southern England does, and that's more likely why you see that correlation there.
    Would this explain your ridiculously high Northumbria percentage over on LivingDNA.

    Kind Regards

    Jonathan McGuinness

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    Quote Originally Posted by sktibo View Post
    What I'm saying is that if you pick a population that is mixed, then other people which are mixed are going to match with that population. We know that mixed people often get a lot of Great Britain, and that someone with all ancestry from Kent got 94% Great Britain, indicating that SE England is a place where lots of samples are from for the GB category. We also know that the southeast English are a genetically mixed population. So, mixed people end up matching with a mixed population; and to clarify that when I say mixed here I'm referring to mixed NW European people.
    As you know all my Ancestry comes from Ulster half Ulster Scot, Half Ulster Irish and my Great Britain percentage is 22%, 0% Europe West, 76% Ireland and 1% Scandinavian and a bizarre 1% European Jewish.

    Kind Regards

    Jonathan McGuinness

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    I've picked up the European Jewish, but the 3% Eastern European was even more shocking.

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