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Thread: New K12 Ancient Calculator

  1. #491
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    If British, or NW Europeans don't descend from the Neolithic/Chalcolithic Iberians, why do they score such a high value of Western Farmer? Shouldn't it be overwhelmingly Eastern farmer? I'm actually not suggesting these methods are wrong, I'm wondering the whole 90% replacement in Bronze Age Britain is off, quite a bit.
    YDNA: R1b-Z220 (A7066+) (1800's Stepney, London(Bethnal Green), UK George Wood b. 1782
    maternal-grandfather YDNA: ? Gurr, George 1843, Feversham, Kent, England.
    maternal-grandmother YDNA: ? Beech, John Richard b. 1780, Lewes, England
    maternal-ggrandfather YDNA R1b-U106 Thomas, Edward b 1854, Sittingbourne, Kent
    paternal-ggf YDNA: R1b-L48. Gould, John Somerset England 1800s.
    paternal-ggf YDNA: R1b-L48. Scott, William Hamilton mdka Ireland(?) < 1800s

  2. #492
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    Carolina, N. America
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    H1

    England Scotland Wales Germany Ireland Sweden Finns
    Here are my results

    ANCIENT FARMERS 46.7%
    - WEST EUROPEAN FARMERS (4000-5000 years) 14.8%
    - LEVANT (4000-8000 years) 3.9%
    - NEOLITHIC-CHALCOLITHIC IRAN-CHG (5000-12000 years) 2.7%
    - EAST EUROPEAN FARMERS (5000-8000 years) 25.2%

    STEPPE CULTURES 35.3%
    - KARASUK-E SCYTHIAN (2000-3000 years) 8.7%
    - ANDRONOVO-SRUBNAYA (3000-4000 years) 15.2%
    - YAMNAYA-AFANASIEVO-POLTAVKA (4000-5000 years)11.4%

    WESTERN EUROPEAN & SCANDINAVIAN HUNTER GATHERERS (4000-5000 years) 18.0%

    Everything else is 0%

    On paper Ancestry:
    ~80% GB & Ireland. ~20% NW European. 1% India & Romany.
    English=37% Scot/Ulster-Scot=27% Welsh=14% Irish=3% German=14% Scandinavian=3% India=1% French & Dutch=1%
    Last edited by MitchellSince1893; 09-12-2017 at 05:27 PM.
    Genetic info
     
    U152>L2>Z49>Z142>Z12222>FGC12378>FGC12384. Yfull YF01489. YSEARCH 2PJVS.
    Earliest Known Paternal Ancestor: Edward Leopold Mitchell (NPE), b 1893, London, England

    Ancestry: English=37% Scot/Ulster-Scot=27% Welsh=14% Irish=3% German=14% Scandinavian=3% India=1% French & Dutch=1%

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  4. #493
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    Quote Originally Posted by ADW_1981 View Post
    If British, or NW Europeans don't descend from the Neolithic/Chalcolithic Iberians, why do they score such a high value of Western Farmer? Shouldn't it be overwhelmingly Eastern farmer? I'm actually not suggesting these methods are wrong, I'm wondering the whole 90% replacement in Bronze Age Britain is off, quite a bit.
    This makes absolutely no sense . I am not aware of any impenetrable wall separating western Europe from Britain. If anything south western Europe is closer to Britain than southeastern Europe, and Iberians and W French have easier access to Britain than SE Europeans.

    Even hypothetically if there was a 90% population replacement in Britain in the Bronze Age don't you think people from Iberia and W France have migrated to Britain since then.
    EurasianDNA.com - A study of the population history of West & South Asia.

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     kingjohn (09-12-2017)

  6. #494
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurd View Post
    This makes absolutely no sense . I am not aware of any impenetrable wall separating western Europe from Britain. If anything south western Europe is closer to Britain than southeastern Europe, and Iberians and W French have easier access to Britain than SE Europeans.

    Even hypothetically if there was a 90% population replacement in Britain in the Bronze Age don't you think people from Iberia and W France have migrated to Britain since then.
    You probably aren't up to date on British research papers and aren't following what I said. I'm not suggesting you are wrong, I'm posing an open question for clarification to determine why Rathlin and BB British genomes suggest LBK continuity rather than Iberian.

    Do you have the Iron Age genomes or possibly Rathlin genomes from Britain available to you to run through this test? And no, I don't think there has been enough migration to Britain since the Bronze to go from 0% Iberian farmer (if Rathhin and BB Britain are correctly LBK only) to 25-30% in a modern English sample.
    YDNA: R1b-Z220 (A7066+) (1800's Stepney, London(Bethnal Green), UK George Wood b. 1782
    maternal-grandfather YDNA: ? Gurr, George 1843, Feversham, Kent, England.
    maternal-grandmother YDNA: ? Beech, John Richard b. 1780, Lewes, England
    maternal-ggrandfather YDNA R1b-U106 Thomas, Edward b 1854, Sittingbourne, Kent
    paternal-ggf YDNA: R1b-L48. Gould, John Somerset England 1800s.
    paternal-ggf YDNA: R1b-L48. Scott, William Hamilton mdka Ireland(?) < 1800s

  7. #495
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    lbk farmer lady germany Stuttgart

    Population
    Amerindian -
    Arabian 1.62
    Armenian -
    Basque -
    Central_African -
    Central_Euro -
    East_African -
    East_Asian -
    East_Balkan 2.65
    East_Central_Asian -
    East_Central_Euro -
    East_Med 14.94
    Eastern_Euro -
    Fennoscandian -
    French -
    Iberian 16.26 iberian it is there but not huge
    Indo-Chinese -
    Italian 34.83
    Malayan -
    Near_Eastern 0.42
    North_African 2.44
    North_Atlantic -
    North_Caucasian -
    North_Sea -
    Northeast_African -
    Oceanian -
    Omotic -
    Pygmy -
    Siberian -
    South_Asian -
    South_Central_Asian -
    South_Chinese -
    Volga-Ural -
    West_African -
    West_Caucasian -
    West_Med 26.83


    neolithic ireland britain
    huge iberian


    most of the chances the farmers of Ireland came from south west Europe originally iberia and France rather than the lbk farmers from central Europe
    she also score no east med or east Balkan elements that were present in the eastern farmers
    and she score huge huge Iberian ........


    neolithic lady ireland

    Population
    Amerindian -
    Arabian -
    Armenian -
    Basque 6.05
    Central_African -
    Central_Euro -
    East_African -
    East_Asian -
    East_Balkan 0.49
    East_Central_Asian -
    East_Central_Euro -
    East_Med - nada both stutgart and ne1 from hungary score east med and ne1 also score east balkan and this irish lady only 0.49% balkan
    Eastern_Euro -
    Fennoscandian -
    French 2.46
    Iberian 37.58 wow huge............................
    Indo-Chinese -
    Italian 23.66
    Malayan -
    Near_Eastern -
    North_African 4.96
    North_Atlantic 1.46
    North_Caucasian -
    North_Sea -
    Northeast_African -
    Oceanian -
    Omotic -
    Pygmy -
    Siberian -
    South_Asian -
    South_Central_Asian -
    South_Chinese -
    Volga-Ural -
    West_African -
    West_Caucasian -
    West_Med 23.32
    eurogenes k13
    Lebanese_Muslim + Lebanese_Muslim + Serbian + Tuscan @ 1.235682
    do

    AJ + RO + Samaritan + South_Italian_&_Sicilian @ 2.93306
    geno 2 next genration after fixed rounding error : i am 99% human + 1% archaic caveman
    dodecad k7b
    1 Druze + Lithuanian + S_Italian_Sicilian + Samaritians @ 0.000000 Hidden Content Hidden Content

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  9. #496
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    Quote Originally Posted by ADW_1981 View Post
    You probably aren't up to date on British research papers and aren't following what I said. I'm not suggesting you are wrong, I'm posing an open question for clarification to determine why Rathlin and BB British genomes suggest LBK continuity rather than Iberian.

    Do you have the Iron Age genomes or possibly Rathlin genomes from Britain available to you to run through this test? And no, I don't think there has been enough migration to Britain since the Bronze to go from 0% Iberian farmer (if Rathhin and BB Britain are correctly LBK only) to 25-30% in a modern English sample.
    I don't have the Rathlin genomes. You can post a link for plink or vcf files and I will try to make time (bams take longer to process)

    Hayden's spreadsheet shows 13 - 30% for British.

    3500 years is a very long time...
    EurasianDNA.com - A study of the population history of West & South Asia.

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  11. #497
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingjohn View Post
    lbk farmer lady germany Stuttgart

    Population
    Amerindian -
    Arabian 1.62
    Armenian -
    Basque -
    Central_African -
    Central_Euro -
    East_African -
    East_Asian -
    East_Balkan 2.65
    East_Central_Asian -
    East_Central_Euro -
    East_Med 14.94
    Eastern_Euro -
    Fennoscandian -
    French -
    Iberian 16.26 iberian it is there but not huge
    Indo-Chinese -
    Italian 34.83
    Malayan -
    Near_Eastern 0.42
    North_African 2.44
    North_Atlantic -
    North_Caucasian -
    North_Sea -
    Northeast_African -
    Oceanian -
    Omotic -
    Pygmy -
    Siberian -
    South_Asian -
    South_Central_Asian -
    South_Chinese -
    Volga-Ural -
    West_African -
    West_Caucasian -
    West_Med 26.83


    neolithic ireland britain
    huge iberian


    most of the chances the farmers of Ireland came from south west Europe originally iberia and France rather than the lbk farmers from central Europe
    she also score no east med or east Balkan elements that were present in the eastern farmers
    and she score huge huge Iberian ........


    neolithic lady ireland

    Population
    Amerindian -
    Arabian -
    Armenian -
    Basque 6.05
    Central_African -
    Central_Euro -
    East_African -
    East_Asian -
    East_Balkan 0.49
    East_Central_Asian -
    East_Central_Euro -
    East_Med - nada both stutgart and ne1 from hungary score east med and ne1 also score east balkan and this irish lady only 0.49% balkan
    Eastern_Euro -
    Fennoscandian -
    French 2.46
    Iberian 37.58 wow huge............................
    Indo-Chinese -
    Italian 23.66
    Malayan -
    Near_Eastern -
    North_African 4.96
    North_Atlantic 1.46
    North_Caucasian -
    North_Sea -
    Northeast_African -
    Oceanian -
    Omotic -
    Pygmy -
    Siberian -
    South_Asian -
    South_Central_Asian -
    South_Chinese -
    Volga-Ural -
    West_African -
    West_Caucasian -
    West_Med 23.32
    I'm willing to bet that the K12 Ancient test will have much more accurate numbers for Stuttgart and Ireland N
    EurasianDNA.com - A study of the population history of West & South Asia.

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  13. #498
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    i don't think it is good idea to test ancients with the calculator
    because for example : you used Stuttgart as one of the reference for the east european farmer component
    it is going to blow up the calculation isn't it ?
    adam
    eurogenes k13
    Lebanese_Muslim + Lebanese_Muslim + Serbian + Tuscan @ 1.235682
    do

    AJ + RO + Samaritan + South_Italian_&_Sicilian @ 2.93306
    geno 2 next genration after fixed rounding error : i am 99% human + 1% archaic caveman
    dodecad k7b
    1 Druze + Lithuanian + S_Italian_Sicilian + Samaritians @ 0.000000 Hidden Content Hidden Content

  14. #499
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingjohn View Post
    i don't think it is good idea to test ancients with the calculator
    because for example : you used Stuttgart as one of the reference for the east european farmer component
    it is going to blow up the calculation isn't it ?
    adam
    Yes you are correct Stuttgart should score around 100% Eastern European farmer . To be fair other ancients which are not part of the reference set, such as the Irish genomes should be checked here against other calculators
    EurasianDNA.com - A study of the population history of West & South Asia.

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  16. #500
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dibran View Post
    Interesting. Which company did you test? Pretty much no Albanians Greeks or Italians are getting any WE & SHG. If so its usually noise less than a percent.
    23andme. This does seem a little odd, I have no known recent northern or western European ancestry which could explain my elevated WHG/SHG relative to other Balkanites/Southern Euros.

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