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Thread: FTDNA my origins 2.0 failure......

  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacEochaidh View Post
    Here ya go, plus a Eurogenes K32 PCA plot map. Do remember that I have recent French Canadian ancestry 25%. My maternal grandmother was a native born Quebecoise whose first language was French. My mother's paternal side was from Belfast as was my my father.

    Attachment 15364Attachment 15366Attachment 15367Attachment 15368
    Thank you. Just trying to think of any reason this calculator may have given you this odd result. It looks like you have a higher neolithic percentage than a lot of Northern Europeans. IIRC your FTDNA ancient origins gave you Neolithic Farmer as your highest percentage? Some people have suggested that this calculator has a very difficult time telling British Isles from W&C Europe, perhaps your more southern European / Neolithic amounts were enough to tip it's calculation in that direction.
    I'm no scientist of course, this is just my theory.
    Paper trail ancestry to the best of my knowledge:
    English 28.12%, East German or Eastern European 25%, Scottish 17.96%, Irish (mostly lowland Scottish origin) 12.5%, French 8.2%, Welsh 3.125%, Native American 1.95%, and Colonial American, 3.125%, which cannot be determined with complete certainty: there is Dutch (at least 1.36%) and some English. The rest could include Spanish, Norwegian, German, and French, but these percentages would be minuscule.

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     Jessie (04-21-2017)

  3. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by sktibo View Post
    Thank you. Just trying to think of any reason this calculator may have given you this odd result. It looks like you have a higher neolithic percentage than a lot of Northern Europeans. IIRC your FTDNA ancient origins gave you Neolithic Farmer as your highest percentage? Some people have suggested that this calculator has a very difficult time telling British Isles from W&C Europe, perhaps your more southern European / Neolithic amounts were enough to tip it's calculation in that direction.
    I'm no scientist of course, this is just my theory.
    Yes I was trying to work out why I got Southeastern Europe in MyOrigins on the newer version. Basically there is no reason for it and I can't work it out.

    My Ancient Origins are the same as my brother. He got 11% Southeastern Europe and I got 9% Southeastern Europe before we were both 100% British Isles which frankly made a lot more sense.


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  5. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessie View Post
    Yes I was trying to work out why I got Southeastern Europe in MyOrigins on the newer version. Basically there is no reason for it and I can't work it out.

    My Ancient Origins are the same as my brother. He got 11% Southeastern Europe and I got 9% Southeastern Europe before we were both 100% British Isles which frankly made a lot more sense.

    I also feel that it's a less accurate now that 1.0 was for myself, (however 1.0 wasn't accurate either for me) but I've seen a lot of people, like Norfolk and Firemonkey, for whom 2.0 seems to be more accurate. I think it's a change in what some of the populations are comprised of, combined with the age old problem of trying to separate Western Europe from Britain, which apparently doesn't always work so well.

    Also, Jessie, can you please clear your inbox up a bit? Trying to send you a message but it tells me your inbox is full/at capacity
    Paper trail ancestry to the best of my knowledge:
    English 28.12%, East German or Eastern European 25%, Scottish 17.96%, Irish (mostly lowland Scottish origin) 12.5%, French 8.2%, Welsh 3.125%, Native American 1.95%, and Colonial American, 3.125%, which cannot be determined with complete certainty: there is Dutch (at least 1.36%) and some English. The rest could include Spanish, Norwegian, German, and French, but these percentages would be minuscule.

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     Jessie (04-21-2017)

  7. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacEochaidh View Post
    In my case, FTDNA myOrigins 2.0 did the exact opposite. My 71% British Isles on myOrigins 1.0 became only 4% British Isles on myOrigins 2.0 Also, my Western and Central Europe went from 0% on myOrigins 1.0 to a staggering 96% on myOrigins 2.0

    How does anyone explain this since my known ancestry is 75% Isles and 25% French Canadian.
    We can only speculate but first things to take into account is:

    1. Your case is actually exceptional and the change for most Britons seems to operate exactly the other way around.
    2. Your ancestry on paper and your genes are two separate things.
    3. Almost nobody is "100%" something. Everybody has certain admixture and your supposed 75% british ancestors would not score necessarily 100% british if you could test them. Probably all of them had percentages of other contributions on different proportions.
    4. You inherit the genes of your ancestry randomly. You get half from each parent but you cannot predict which half.
    4b. By chance, you could have inherited all the "Non-British" contribution from your british ancestry and minimized the markers that My Origins 2.0 labels as "british isles".

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     spruithean (08-29-2017)

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    Quote Originally Posted by mlcarson View Post
    The problem with the gedmatch calculators is that I don't understand them. I have no idea what the differences are between the options and I can't understand the output. At least with FTDNA and Ancestry, the results are easy to understand even though I'm left wondering how they calculated them. I just know that the expected output on FTDNA's is not what my paper trail would indicate and that the latest version appears to be worse than the previous.
    Gedmatch offers several algorithms but only Eurogenes and MDLP seem to be specific for people of European descent.

    The Oracle would try to predict your admixture based on the markers adjusting your data to their reference populations and combinations of them.

    The number after the "@" (must be the variance or covariance, I cannot remember) tells you how accurate the algorithm thinks your prediction is.

    If you get an Oracle admixture with a distance over 4 or 5, just take it as a rough approximation. If it is below 3, the algorithm thinks it is accurate.
    Last edited by Shadogowah; 04-21-2017 at 09:28 AM.

  10. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadogowah View Post
    We can only speculate but first things to take into account is:

    1. Your case is actually exceptional and the change for most Britons seems to operate exactly the other way around.
    2. Your ancestry on paper and your genes are two separate things.
    3. Almost nobody is "100%" something. Everybody has certain admixture and your supposed 75% british ancestors would not score necessarily 100% british if you could test them. Probably all of them had percentages of other contributions on different proportions.
    4. You inherit the genes of your ancestry randomly. You get half from each parent but you cannot predict which half.
    4b. By chance, you could have inherited all the "Non-British" contribution from your british ancestry and minimized the markers that My Origins 2.0 labels as "british isles".
    All my family had 100% British Isles previously now we have some bizarre results my mother and myself have small amounts of NA, she has 5% Finnish and my daughter gets a small percentage of Siberian. The biggest thing though is the Southeast European. No ancestry whatsoever from there. We are all Irish and that is going back generations. The changes doesn't make sense for my family compared to other tests and also Gedmatch. I'm convinced there is something wrong with this upgrade.

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    Given that I only have a complete list of ancestors up to 3gt and after that it gets really patchy, I'm hesitant to say there is no different admixture going further back. Given that admixture tends to indicate ancestry 300-500 years back that's most of 1024+ ancestors I know nothing about.
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  14. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by firemonkey View Post
    Given that I only have a complete list of ancestors up to 3gt and after that it gets really patchy, I'm hesitant to say there is no different admixture going further back. Given that admixture tends to indicate ancestry 300-500 years back that's most of 1024+ ancestors I know nothing about.
    Possibly but if you know an areas history you can make an assumption based on known migrations and also dna studies. You could possibly accept some regional breakdowns are more likely but others are a bit difficult to make sense of especially if the timeframe is only 300-500 years. If you have no ancestry from a certain area for 300 years (and most likely much further back going on surnames) it is a bit odd that some of these unusual categories are popping up. A bit of a red flag for me especially if the last breakdown was 100% British Isles for all family members and then with this new update regions showing up where there is very unlikely to be ancestry from.

    Logically there is something off about this new update. I would not be surprised if people's Ancestry Compositions change again when My Origins 3 is implemented.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sktibo View Post
    Thank you. Just trying to think of any reason this calculator may have given you this odd result. It looks like you have a higher neolithic percentage than a lot of Northern Europeans. IIRC your FTDNA ancient origins gave you Neolithic Farmer as your highest percentage? Some people have suggested that this calculator has a very difficult time telling British Isles from W&C Europe, perhaps your more southern European / Neolithic amounts were enough to tip it's calculation in that direction.
    I'm no scientist of course, this is just my theory.
    Yes, I have a high Neolithic Farmer score of 45%. Still, I have three Belfast grandparents and one French Canadian grandparent. FTDNA myOrigins 1.0 got it very close to accurate with 71% Isles, 8% Scandinavian, and 14% Southwest Europe.

    Ancient Origins.jpg
    Y-DNA R-DF23>ZP149>ZP171 MDKA Denis Doherty, b. 1789, Eskaheen, Donegal Ireland.
    mtDNA T2g1 MDKA Francoise Arguin, b. 1698, Camaret-Sur-Mer, Bretagne, France

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessie View Post
    Possibly but if you know an areas history you can make an assumption based on known migrations and also dna studies. You could possibly accept some regional breakdowns are more likely but others are a bit difficult to make sense of especially if the timeframe is only 300-500 years. If you have no ancestry from a certain area for 300 years (and most likely much further back going on surnames) it is a bit odd that some of these unusual categories are popping up. A bit of a red flag for me especially if the last breakdown was 100% British Isles for all family members and then with this new update regions showing up where there is very unlikely to be ancestry from.

    Logically there is something off about this new update. I would not be surprised if people's Ancestry Compositions change again when My Origins 3 is implemented.
    You may well be right, but I readily confess I'm not that bright when it comes to matters of dna and migration. It's hard for me to know how to weight the various admixture results when it comes to likely accuracy, especially as more learned people than me often tend to disagree on such matters.
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